By: MarkG
- 24th February 2005 at 19:27Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Anybody got any idea what this lot is ?
Yup. That's a load of instruments that is. No question about it. :)
Seriously, you have quite a mixture of post-war instruments there. A rate-of climb indicator in the top right corner, three turn-and-slips, that box in the middle is a gyro compass corrector box as fitted to Hunters, Vampires, Sea Hawks etc..
And (silly question) what is a turn and slip ?
A turn-and-slip is basically an instrument which indicates to the pilot the rate of turn of the aircraft, and the amount of side-slip. The older British T and S did this with two seperate needles (you have two of the later 2-needle types in the bottom right corner of your photo), the alternative type of T and S is the type you see in the top left corner which has a needle to indicate the rate of turn but a ball (in damping fluid) to indicate the side-slip.
The rate of turn needle is operated by an electrically or vacuum operated rate gyro, and the side-slip indicator usually works using a relatively simple pendulum arrangement within the instrument and centrifugal/centripetal force.
Incidentally, to correct the side-slip you "step on the ball" so if the ball drifts to the right you depress the right rudder pedal to correct for it. This is simplified rather, and I'm sure the people who know what they're talking about will correct me, but you get the idea!
By the way, I know of someone who is looking for a pair of the 2-needle T and S you have there, so if you fancy parting with them let me know :D
By: 682al
- 26th February 2005 at 23:39Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
It looks very much like a service type Mk VB Air Speed Indicator, in which case it will be Stores Reference 6A/257 if luminous, or 6A/258 if non-luminous.
As to "what's it from?", you have to understand that these gauges were common to many types and it's not always easy to i.d. them precisely.
Try looking at cockpit photos for early 1930's service types, especially those with a speed range of 40 - 160 m.p.h....
By: Dave Homewood
- 27th February 2005 at 01:30Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Does anyone happen to have drawngs in particular, or photos of the panel and cockpit fittings of the Lockheed Hudson? I'm especially interested in the MkIII or IIIA, but also MkV and MkVI.
I am planning to scratchbuild a model in about 1/15th scale of a Hudson cockpit, from the cabin door foward. I have exterior drawings and also a number of photos but I want actual drawings of fittings etc so I can get the scale right. Any suggestions welcome.
By: Rocketeer
- 27th February 2005 at 04:32Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Does anyone happen to have drawngs in particular, or photos of the panel and cockpit fittings of the Lockheed Hudson? I'm especially interested in the MkIII or IIIA, but also MkV and MkVI.
I am planning to scratchbuild a model in about 1/15th scale of a Hudson cockpit, from the cabin door foward. I have exterior drawings and also a number of photos but I want actual drawings of fittings etc so I can get the scale right. Any suggestions welcome.
Cheers
Dave
Crecy do pilots notes....can get them through/from Newark Air Museum
By: Dave Homewood
- 27th February 2005 at 07:48Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Thanks Olivier,
That's a good photo, and is from a different angle than the wartime one I have, which I got from a chap who worked on Hudsons in No. 3 Squadron RNZAF up in the Pacific. It will be helpful.
By: benyboy
- 7th March 2005 at 20:51Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Does anybody know where I can get hold of some screws for my panel. I have tried a few places (DIY stores ect.) and have been told I need to go to a specialist supplier.
By: FLY.BUY
- 7th March 2005 at 21:37Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Regarding the screws, read the forum pages of this web site: www.internationalcockpitclub.org.uk they list a number of mail order companies who sell BA screws (suitable for instrument panels).
By: Rocketeer
- 8th March 2005 at 03:20Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Regarding the screws, read the forum pages of this web site: www.internationalcockpitclub.org.uk they list a number of mail order companies who sell BA screws (suitable for instrument panels).
682al should be able to help...when I am back on the circuit and unpacked, I can let people have BA stuff for low prices (depending on what you need)
By: TEXANTOMCAT
- 9th March 2005 at 09:02Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Does anyone know the exact spec of the standard 'panel' bolt? I need some too but got a bit confused by the ICC supplier's website.... by the looks of things those instruments with captive nuts all use the same size thread bolt - is that right....?
By: MarkG
- 9th March 2005 at 10:17Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Most old British instruments use 4BA screws to secure them to the panel. Some of the bigger items might use a larger 2BA screw but the majority are 4BA.
They are usually countersunk, but some will have a round head.
By the 1960's there was a move to unify thread sizes (by Britain, US and Canada) and so UNC and UNF sizes started to be used.
If you get hold of a load of 4BA countersunk head screws of about 1" long though, you'll be able to fit most, but not all, older British instruments.
Posts: 789
By: MarkG - 24th February 2005 at 19:27 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Yup. That's a load of instruments that is. No question about it. :)Seriously, you have quite a mixture of post-war instruments there. A rate-of climb indicator in the top right corner, three turn-and-slips, that box in the middle is a gyro compass corrector box as fitted to Hunters, Vampires, Sea Hawks etc..
A turn-and-slip is basically an instrument which indicates to the pilot the rate of turn of the aircraft, and the amount of side-slip. The older British T and S did this with two seperate needles (you have two of the later 2-needle types in the bottom right corner of your photo), the alternative type of T and S is the type you see in the top left corner which has a needle to indicate the rate of turn but a ball (in damping fluid) to indicate the side-slip.
The rate of turn needle is operated by an electrically or vacuum operated rate gyro, and the side-slip indicator usually works using a relatively simple pendulum arrangement within the instrument and centrifugal/centripetal force.
Incidentally, to correct the side-slip you "step on the ball" so if the ball drifts to the right you depress the right rudder pedal to correct for it. This is simplified rather, and I'm sure the people who know what they're talking about will correct me, but you get the idea!
By the way, I know of someone who is looking for a pair of the 2-needle T and S you have there, so if you fancy parting with them let me know :D
Posts: 1,943
By: benyboy - 24th February 2005 at 21:58 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Thank you MARKG
I will be parting with a few of the instruments but not until I know what they all are and how much they are worth.
P.S Lanc panel on Ebay http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=4721&item=6514660225&rd=1
Posts: 10,185
By: Peter - 26th February 2005 at 20:26 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Wonder how much this will be going for????
I wonder if this panel will see the same prices that the previous panel attained on ebay??
Posts: 10,185
By: Peter - 26th February 2005 at 22:13 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
AJmarch....?
Are there any part numbers on it at all? 682AL might be able to help. It definately looks like a very early type of guage..
Posts: 718
By: 682al - 26th February 2005 at 23:39 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
It looks very much like a service type Mk VB Air Speed Indicator, in which case it will be Stores Reference 6A/257 if luminous, or 6A/258 if non-luminous.
As to "what's it from?", you have to understand that these gauges were common to many types and it's not always easy to i.d. them precisely.
Try looking at cockpit photos for early 1930's service types, especially those with a speed range of 40 - 160 m.p.h....
Posts: 5,592
By: Dave Homewood - 27th February 2005 at 01:30 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Does anyone happen to have drawngs in particular, or photos of the panel and cockpit fittings of the Lockheed Hudson? I'm especially interested in the MkIII or IIIA, but also MkV and MkVI.
I am planning to scratchbuild a model in about 1/15th scale of a Hudson cockpit, from the cabin door foward. I have exterior drawings and also a number of photos but I want actual drawings of fittings etc so I can get the scale right. Any suggestions welcome.
Cheers
Dave
Posts: 5,197
By: Rocketeer - 27th February 2005 at 04:32 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Crecy do pilots notes....can get them through/from Newark Air Museum
Posts: 5,592
By: Dave Homewood - 27th February 2005 at 05:51 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
That's an idea I'll look into. But are pilot's notes drawings accurate and scale though?
Posts: 215
By: NC900 - 27th February 2005 at 07:24 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
HUDSON COCKPIT
One of the best original shot of this cockpit.
Regards,
Olivier
Posts: 5,592
By: Dave Homewood - 27th February 2005 at 07:48 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Thanks Olivier,
That's a good photo, and is from a different angle than the wartime one I have, which I got from a chap who worked on Hudsons in No. 3 Squadron RNZAF up in the Pacific. It will be helpful.
Posts: 1,317
By: Robert Whitton - 27th February 2005 at 10:19 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Here are some photos from Strathallan taken about 1972 the Hudson is now in the RAF museum.
Posts: 5,592
By: Dave Homewood - 27th February 2005 at 10:51 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Thanks Robert, really good pictures. Was it still flyng then?
Are the colours it wears now with the kangaroo on the nose an RAAF scheme or an RAF scheme?
Posts: 1,317
By: Robert Whitton - 27th February 2005 at 13:10 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
According to wrecks and relics
Its a Mk111a
G-BEOX VH-AGJ VH-SMM
A16-199, FH174 41-36975
it is marked as A16-199 SF-R
Posts: 1,317
By: Robert Whitton - 27th February 2005 at 13:11 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Forgot to say that it flew in fron Oz but then never moved as far as I am aware until the museum was broken up.
Posts: 1,943
By: benyboy - 7th March 2005 at 20:51 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Does anybody know where I can get hold of some screws for my panel. I have tried a few places (DIY stores ect.) and have been told I need to go to a specialist supplier.
Posts: 1,424
By: FLY.BUY - 7th March 2005 at 21:37 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Regarding the screws, read the forum pages of this web site: www.internationalcockpitclub.org.uk they list a number of mail order companies who sell BA screws (suitable for instrument panels).
Posts: 5,197
By: Rocketeer - 8th March 2005 at 03:20 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
682al should be able to help...when I am back on the circuit and unpacked, I can let people have BA stuff for low prices (depending on what you need)
Posts: 4,561
By: TEXANTOMCAT - 9th March 2005 at 09:02 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Does anyone know the exact spec of the standard 'panel' bolt? I need some too but got a bit confused by the ICC supplier's website.... by the looks of things those instruments with captive nuts all use the same size thread bolt - is that right....?
TTFN
TT
Posts: 789
By: MarkG - 9th March 2005 at 10:17 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Most old British instruments use 4BA screws to secure them to the panel. Some of the bigger items might use a larger 2BA screw but the majority are 4BA.
They are usually countersunk, but some will have a round head.
By the 1960's there was a move to unify thread sizes (by Britain, US and Canada) and so UNC and UNF sizes started to be used.
If you get hold of a load of 4BA countersunk head screws of about 1" long though, you'll be able to fit most, but not all, older British instruments.
Posts: 1,494
By: TempestV - 16th March 2005 at 13:03 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
DH Hornet F.1 Instrument panels
DH Hornet F.1 Instrument panels