Que.....jet Lancaster
Are we sure this is at Heathrow???
Air intake at the nose, I guess :-)...Yes, those look like the semi-detached houses along the northern side of the Bath Road (between New Rd and what is now Mondial Rd). before the pre-fab airline offices appeared on the apron edge opposite ...so could be 1946 but after the tents were replaced
View in link is looking about 30degrees more easterly
By: connie freak
- 15th September 2016 at 22:23Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
The lancastrians pictured are regular prop versions. It is LAP Northside. The pub that became the "Air Hostess" can be made out. Jet Lancastrians had outboard jet engines.
By: longshot
- 15th September 2016 at 23:49Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
https://www.flickr.com/photos/74784995@N00/27717337652/sizes/o/
Above a crop from a Britain from Above aerial of Heathrow 1946 ...a lot of the 'buildings' on the edge of the apron are possibly tents, but the tower is there bottom RH corner
And the Air Hostess was the Bricklayers Arms until 1954 apparently...the original Green Dragon cafe was along the Bath Rd in that parade until about 1958
By: clickaway
- 10th May 2018 at 22:42Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
a few months on from the last post here, but here's a question for you all.
I've just discovered a photo of a tunnel mouth between the Europa and Oceanic buildings taken in 1959, which I believe is where the later cargo area tunnel was built.
By: Firebird
- 11th May 2018 at 08:50Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Interesting, as, you are correct, that is definately the area where the exit to the cargo tunnel is, but the cargo tunnel didn't open until 1968, so very confusing?
If the photo was taken in 1959, and it does look that era, I'm guessing the subject reason was the AF Caravelle, as the Caravelle entered service with AF in mid-1959, so could be first AF Caravelle at London Airport...?
The company I started work at from school built the cargo tunnel, and one of the Engineers that sat near me in the office when I first started had worked on site building it after he left Uni.
By: Firebird
- 11th May 2018 at 13:09Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
They are the vehicle tunnels to the stands.......very short, only go under the taxiway's - you can see the head of the tunnel portal just the other side of that link taxiway in the photo.
If you go that Guardian link posted in #315, and look at the yellow map, they have even marked the line of the tunnel as it goes at 45 deg under the taxiway to the rear of the hardstand area.
Probably got backfilled before they built the cargo tunnel 10 years later.
It's right under the current location of the T3 A380 stand.
By: ianwoodward9
- 11th May 2018 at 15:38Permalink- Edited 9th November 2019 at 17:06
I'm glad this thread has come back up again. I missed Ian Sayer's list of those who gathered on the Great South West Road opposite Cain's Lane, at the time it was posted. In the late 1950s and early 1960s, I spent many an hour on the grass beside the Gt South West Road, the A30. It was not much more than a mile from where I lived at that time. Having lived and worked, since then, in places from Scotland to the Midlands, I now live less than a mile off the A30 but further west.
Anyway, back to then. Barry Hawkes was known as 'Ben' (from the initials of his forenames - Barry Ernest Norman). He lived on Bedfont Lane (more towards the level crossing at Feltham than the Staines Road end). His Dad was the local agent for the Labour Party and I think I got 2/6d for running voters' numbers from a voting station to the Labour Party office, where party members tried to work who had not yet voted and, based on the canvassing returns, directed cars to drive them to the voting station. BEN went on to become a lawyer.
The voting station was in a school on Tachbrook Road, almost opposite where Brian Stainer lived. I visited there quite a few times (my gran used to live in Shakespeare Avenue, only a couple of streets away). Brian had an Aerial Leader and, later, a bright red bubble car (an Isetta, I think).
I think Ken Ede used to live in Southville Road, just off Bedfont Lane. His dad was the groundsman at the Bedfont (Lane) Rec(reation) Ground, as I recall. I think we got a few free 'goes' at bowling there.
Alun Jones, whose father taught in a technical college on the other side of the airport (Southall?), lived on Hounslow Road, almost opposite Lansbury Avenue, very close to where I lived.
To get to the Gt. S W Road by bike, I would commonly come out on to Hounslow Road, turn down Lansbury Avenue, cross Harlington Road West and cycle down Burns Avenue, which became Tachbrook Road, turn right down Bedfont Lane, past Southville Road on the left, cross Staines Road at an angle, down Richmond Avenue to the footbridge over the Duke of Northumberland River, and then along the path between allotments and playing fields and come out on Hatton Road almost opposite Cains Lane.
In those days, you could still make out where Cains Lane used to go, across LAP towards Sipson and Harlington.
John Davison's father was an architect and they lived on Uxbridge Road just before the school playing fields (on the left coming from the airport). This was adjacent to what I still recall as Hanworth Air Park. I have a very vague memory of a Pou de Ciel still being there but that's probably a false memory.
I think Fred Munday lived in Ashford but that could very well be wrong.
I recall 'Snoggs' and, looking for something in my 1961 pocket diary, I came across a heavily scored out entry on 14 August. Intrigued, I carefully rubbed out the pencil scoring to reveal, in biro, the (immortal?) words, "SNOGGS WROTE THIS". At the back of the diary, I also found this note that I'd made, "ASK SNOGGS. Lloyds 21/12/61 Yank helicopter cr. Was date 5/10/61". I presume I intended to ask him to look up that issue of Lloyds List to check the date of a crash.
I was checking the 1961 diary to see if I'd mentioned a Commando in August 1961; sadly, i had not. I did find that, on one day, I went to Biggin Hill, Gatwick and back to LAP "with Ernie". I'm not sure but I think he was an older chap who appeared occasionally on the Gt. S W Road and used to take his family with him on spotting outings and, from time to time, I would tag along. Does that ring any bells with anyone.
I think "Tommo" was the P.R.Thompson I've noted in another diary as living at Waldegrove Park in Twickenham - POPesgrove telephone exchange.
Another with a POPesgrove number was Paul Arnold (his initials were also P.R.) who lived on Whitton High Street; I don't recall him visiting LAP much but he was certainly an aviation enthusiast, as I have an old postcard from him basically just listing the aircraft he'd spotted on holiday. Both were at H.G.S.
I have a few old copies of the West London Aviation Group newsletter (from around 1962-63); I'll check these for other names.
I also have a photo of Brian Stainer, Vic Gibbs (Albert) and me at an Air-Britain meeting. It was printed in an A-B DIGEST and I'll try to dig that out.
By: ianwoodward9
- 11th May 2018 at 22:20Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
L > R: Dennis Fox, Brian Stainer, me and 'Albert' (V.E.Gibb), second highest scoring team in the 1963 Air Britain recognition contest. I was the lowest scoring of the three of us, which means that, had I been better, we might have been the highest scoring team. The photo was taken by 'G.L.Fisk'.
By: Mark12
- 12th May 2018 at 06:42Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Ian
L > R: Dennis Fox, Brian Stainer, me and 'Albert' (V.E.Gibb), second highest scoring team in the 1963 Air Britain recognition contest. I was the lowest scoring of the three of us, which means that, had I been better, we might have been the highest scoring team. The photo was taken by 'G.L.Fisk'.
G.L.Fisk. That rings a bell. Harrow County Grammar School, CCF, 1950's?
Posts: 70
By: connie freak - 15th September 2016 at 06:42 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
The jet powered Lanc eh ?
Posts: 1,813
By: Planemike - 15th September 2016 at 12:08 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Que.....jet Lancaster ??
Are we sure this is at Heathrow???
Posts: 1,707
By: longshot - 15th September 2016 at 18:34 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
https://www.flickr.com/photos/7691137@N06/4631880489/in/dateposted/
Air intake at the nose, I guess :-)...Yes, those look like the semi-detached houses along the northern side of the Bath Road (between New Rd and what is now Mondial Rd). before the pre-fab airline offices appeared on the apron edge opposite ...so could be 1946 but after the tents were replaced
View in link is looking about 30degrees more easterly
Posts: 1,707
By: longshot - 15th September 2016 at 18:53 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Load of classic Stainer pics from 1950s/1960s here
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_nkw&_sacat=0&LH_Complete=1&_udlo&_udhi&_samilow&_samihi&_sadis=15&_stpos=TR184DG&_fss=1&_fsradio=%26LH_SpecificSeller%3D1&_saslop=1&_sasl=aquarius181920&_dmd=1&_ipg=200&_sop=14
Posts: 70
By: connie freak - 15th September 2016 at 22:23 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
The lancastrians pictured are regular prop versions. It is LAP Northside. The pub that became the "Air Hostess" can be made out. Jet Lancastrians had outboard jet engines.
Posts: 70
By: connie freak - 15th September 2016 at 22:40 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Pic showing Air Hostess pub.
Posts: 1,707
By: longshot - 15th September 2016 at 23:49 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
https://www.flickr.com/photos/74784995@N00/27717337652/sizes/o/
Above a crop from a Britain from Above aerial of Heathrow 1946 ...a lot of the 'buildings' on the edge of the apron are possibly tents, but the tower is there bottom RH corner
And the Air Hostess was the Bricklayers Arms until 1954 apparently...the original Green Dragon cafe was along the Bath Rd in that parade until about 1958
http://www.britainfromabove.org.uk/asearch?search=heathrow
Posts: 1,813
By: Planemike - 16th September 2016 at 00:16 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Yes, knew about the Lancastrian testbeds. These were of course not used by BSAA.......
Posts: 1,707
By: longshot - 16th September 2016 at 12:13 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Didn't know they carried a spare wheel in the bomb-bay!
Posts: 12
By: clickaway - 10th May 2018 at 22:42 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
a few months on from the last post here, but here's a question for you all.
I've just discovered a photo of a tunnel mouth between the Europa and Oceanic buildings taken in 1959, which I believe is where the later cargo area tunnel was built.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/foundin_a_attic/41278581914/in/dateposted//
Back then the cargo area/Terminal 4 was a void, wasn't it, so where did this lead to? Anyone know?
Ray
Posts: 12
By: clickaway - 11th May 2018 at 00:17 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Sorry, I linked the wrong photo, but I've now corrected that. You can try the link again...
Posts: 2,108
By: Firebird - 11th May 2018 at 08:50 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Interesting, as, you are correct, that is definately the area where the exit to the cargo tunnel is, but the cargo tunnel didn't open until 1968, so very confusing?
If the photo was taken in 1959, and it does look that era, I'm guessing the subject reason was the AF Caravelle, as the Caravelle entered service with AF in mid-1959, so could be first AF Caravelle at London Airport...?
The company I started work at from school built the cargo tunnel, and one of the Engineers that sat near me in the office when I first started had worked on site building it after he left Uni.
Posts: 1,707
By: longshot - 11th May 2018 at 12:04 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Clickaway...could you repost the original photo ( and maybe any others from the same session?) ...the cars might help confirm the date
Posts: 12
By: clickaway - 11th May 2018 at 12:25 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Here's the other photo https://www.flickr.com/photos/foundin_a_attic/41953315602/in/photostream/
I'm confident of the date as the guy's other photos are from the same era, but this is the only other one from this day.
I've also found evidence in a photo apparently taken in 1955. https://www.theguardian.com/business/gallery/2016/may/05/heathrow-airport-at-70-in-pictures
ray
Posts: 1,707
By: longshot - 11th May 2018 at 12:59 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Well spotted...so that tunnel was there from the beginning of the Central Area, and it looks like the 1960s Cargo Tunnel perhaps used some of its path
Posts: 2,108
By: Firebird - 11th May 2018 at 13:09 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
They are the vehicle tunnels to the stands.......very short, only go under the taxiway's - you can see the head of the tunnel portal just the other side of that link taxiway in the photo.
If you go that Guardian link posted in #315, and look at the yellow map, they have even marked the line of the tunnel as it goes at 45 deg under the taxiway to the rear of the hardstand area.
Probably got backfilled before they built the cargo tunnel 10 years later.
It's right under the current location of the T3 A380 stand.
Posts: 860
By: ianwoodward9 - 11th May 2018 at 15:38 Permalink - Edited 9th November 2019 at 17:06
I'm glad this thread has come back up again. I missed Ian Sayer's list of those who gathered on the Great South West Road opposite Cain's Lane, at the time it was posted. In the late 1950s and early 1960s, I spent many an hour on the grass beside the Gt South West Road, the A30. It was not much more than a mile from where I lived at that time. Having lived and worked, since then, in places from Scotland to the Midlands, I now live less than a mile off the A30 but further west.
Anyway, back to then. Barry Hawkes was known as 'Ben' (from the initials of his forenames - Barry Ernest Norman). He lived on Bedfont Lane (more towards the level crossing at Feltham than the Staines Road end). His Dad was the local agent for the Labour Party and I think I got 2/6d for running voters' numbers from a voting station to the Labour Party office, where party members tried to work who had not yet voted and, based on the canvassing returns, directed cars to drive them to the voting station. BEN went on to become a lawyer.
The voting station was in a school on Tachbrook Road, almost opposite where Brian Stainer lived. I visited there quite a few times (my gran used to live in Shakespeare Avenue, only a couple of streets away). Brian had an Aerial Leader and, later, a bright red bubble car (an Isetta, I think).
I think Ken Ede used to live in Southville Road, just off Bedfont Lane. His dad was the groundsman at the Bedfont (Lane) Rec(reation) Ground, as I recall. I think we got a few free 'goes' at bowling there.
Alun Jones, whose father taught in a technical college on the other side of the airport (Southall?), lived on Hounslow Road, almost opposite Lansbury Avenue, very close to where I lived.
To get to the Gt. S W Road by bike, I would commonly come out on to Hounslow Road, turn down Lansbury Avenue, cross Harlington Road West and cycle down Burns Avenue, which became Tachbrook Road, turn right down Bedfont Lane, past Southville Road on the left, cross Staines Road at an angle, down Richmond Avenue to the footbridge over the Duke of Northumberland River, and then along the path between allotments and playing fields and come out on Hatton Road almost opposite Cains Lane.
In those days, you could still make out where Cains Lane used to go, across LAP towards Sipson and Harlington.
John Davison's father was an architect and they lived on Uxbridge Road just before the school playing fields (on the left coming from the airport). This was adjacent to what I still recall as Hanworth Air Park. I have a very vague memory of a Pou de Ciel still being there but that's probably a false memory.
I think Fred Munday lived in Ashford but that could very well be wrong.
I recall 'Snoggs' and, looking for something in my 1961 pocket diary, I came across a heavily scored out entry on 14 August. Intrigued, I carefully rubbed out the pencil scoring to reveal, in biro, the (immortal?) words, "SNOGGS WROTE THIS". At the back of the diary, I also found this note that I'd made, "ASK SNOGGS. Lloyds 21/12/61 Yank helicopter cr. Was date 5/10/61". I presume I intended to ask him to look up that issue of Lloyds List to check the date of a crash.
I was checking the 1961 diary to see if I'd mentioned a Commando in August 1961; sadly, i had not. I did find that, on one day, I went to Biggin Hill, Gatwick and back to LAP "with Ernie". I'm not sure but I think he was an older chap who appeared occasionally on the Gt. S W Road and used to take his family with him on spotting outings and, from time to time, I would tag along. Does that ring any bells with anyone.
I think "Tommo" was the P.R.Thompson I've noted in another diary as living at Waldegrove Park in Twickenham - POPesgrove telephone exchange.
Another with a POPesgrove number was Paul Arnold (his initials were also P.R.) who lived on Whitton High Street; I don't recall him visiting LAP much but he was certainly an aviation enthusiast, as I have an old postcard from him basically just listing the aircraft he'd spotted on holiday. Both were at H.G.S.
I have a few old copies of the West London Aviation Group newsletter (from around 1962-63); I'll check these for other names.
I also have a photo of Brian Stainer, Vic Gibbs (Albert) and me at an Air-Britain meeting. It was printed in an A-B DIGEST and I'll try to dig that out.
Posts: 860
By: ianwoodward9 - 11th May 2018 at 22:20 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
L > R: Dennis Fox, Brian Stainer, me and 'Albert' (V.E.Gibb), second highest scoring team in the 1963 Air Britain recognition contest. I was the lowest scoring of the three of us, which means that, had I been better, we might have been the highest scoring team. The photo was taken by 'G.L.Fisk'.
Posts: 1,707
By: longshot - 12th May 2018 at 01:26 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I see what you meant about you being able to slip through gaps that Brian couldn't to get some photos
Posts: 10,029
By: Mark12 - 12th May 2018 at 06:42 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Ian
G.L.Fisk. That rings a bell. Harrow County Grammar School, CCF, 1950's?
Mark