By: Creaking Door
- 26th March 2012 at 14:06Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
You simplify cannot compare this Frigate to the likes of Titian's Diana and Callisto in terms of significance globally or nationally. Now I really like the Rothesay Class frigates and their like, but no way would I claim any really national significance that justifies their preservation.
Why not? What exactly is the ‘national significance’ of this painting to the UK? It wasn’t commissioned in the UK, wasn’t commissioned by a British monarch or subject, wasn’t painted in the UK, wasn’t painted by a British artist, it isn’t about a British subject (in fact it isn’t about any real subject at all) so its only real national significance is that it happened to be bought by some wealthy investors for their own pleasure a few hundred years ago. Not forgetting, of course, that the National Galleries already own a similar piece of ‘national significance’ by the same artist.
Just looking at the example of HMS Alliance shows that there is precious little interest in any one actually spending money on this sort of preservation.
HMS Alliance, precious little interest? Well, thankfully HMS Alliance has just received a government grant of several million pounds to preserve this vessel of ‘national significance’!
Also I rather think the argument that government money shouldn’t be spent on preserving things of ‘precious little interest’ is a dangerous thing to use around paintings of ‘national significance’; if it hadn’t been for the tens of millions of pounds the government threw at these paintings, and the fact that the owner sold them for much less than their commercial value, these painting certainly would never have ended-up on display in the UK.
Surely the whole point of government support it to save the things that are not going to be saved commercially!
By: Rockhopper
- 25th April 2012 at 09:37Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Preserving any ship is massivly expensive. Preserving it in the water is even more expensive. Preserving it out of the water would be cheaper in the long run but massivly expensive in terms of capital cost of the facility that would need to be built to dry dock the ship.
Transporting it the Falklands, well you can guess the answer to that one - massivly expensive as the ship would need lots of work to make it safe to complete the trip then you have the ongoing maintenance costs once it gets there which would be far higher than in the UK due to the weather conditions down there. Plus the cruise ships only visit the islands for a few months of the year so revenue earning would be limited.
I used to visit it in Birkenhead quite often when I lived up that way and to be honest the ship was never a major visitor attraction, there would normally only be a few cars in the car park so I can't ever see it being a big revenue generator.
These days things have to earn their keep and I can't honestly see HMS Plymouth being able to do that. The Goverment just don't have the spare cash to contribute to things like this which is a huge shame.
By: Creaking Door
- 25th April 2012 at 11:49Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I used to visit it in Birkenhead quite often when I lived up that way and to be honest the ship was never a major visitor attraction, there would normally only be a few cars in the car park so I can't ever see it being a big revenue generator.
With respect, that probably had more to do with the location than anything; if you put the ‘London Eye’ in Birkenhead I doubt it would get many visitors...
...and HMS Plymouth survived there for many years.
The government has the money but HMS Plymouth, for some reason, doesn’t tick any of the right boxes.
Imagine it’s thirty years after the end of the Second World War and all the remaining aircraft from that conflict are lined up on the dockside at Birkenhead...
...do you imagine anybody (politicians aside) would scrap them all because of the expense of the museums than now house them?
Posts: 9,739
By: Creaking Door - 26th March 2012 at 14:06 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Why not? What exactly is the ‘national significance’ of this painting to the UK? It wasn’t commissioned in the UK, wasn’t commissioned by a British monarch or subject, wasn’t painted in the UK, wasn’t painted by a British artist, it isn’t about a British subject (in fact it isn’t about any real subject at all) so its only real national significance is that it happened to be bought by some wealthy investors for their own pleasure a few hundred years ago. Not forgetting, of course, that the National Galleries already own a similar piece of ‘national significance’ by the same artist.
HMS Alliance, precious little interest? Well, thankfully HMS Alliance has just received a government grant of several million pounds to preserve this vessel of ‘national significance’!
Also I rather think the argument that government money shouldn’t be spent on preserving things of ‘precious little interest’ is a dangerous thing to use around paintings of ‘national significance’; if it hadn’t been for the tens of millions of pounds the government threw at these paintings, and the fact that the owner sold them for much less than their commercial value, these painting certainly would never have ended-up on display in the UK.
Surely the whole point of government support it to save the things that are not going to be saved commercially!
Posts: 1,421
By: Jon H - 18th April 2012 at 19:28 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Looks like there is a last ditch attempt to save the old girl -
http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/32526
Jon
Posts: 1,067
By: Phantom Phil - 19th April 2012 at 10:06 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Signed - Straight away!!!
Posts: 2,024
By: D1566 - 19th April 2012 at 10:53 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Me too.
Posts: 5,088
By: Blue_2 - 19th April 2012 at 13:34 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Ditto. And shared on facebook.
Posts: 1,067
By: Phantom Phil - 19th April 2012 at 15:06 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I've shared on FB also....
Posts: 216
By: XM172 - 24th April 2012 at 19:51 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
DUELY SIGNED!
Duely signed,,,,I can report back the Wasp is safe and looks splendid after a paint touch up here and there.
Looking for 2 upper rear canopy panels as we need replacements ....any steers welcome!
Posts: 101
By: Biggles of 266 - 24th April 2012 at 21:16 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Apologies for stating the obvious, but would the Falkland Islanders be over the moon to get Plymouth?
And give her a permanent free home? Her preservation would also give a lot of bored servicemen something to do!
Guy
Posts: 161
By: Rockhopper - 25th April 2012 at 09:37 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Preserving any ship is massivly expensive. Preserving it in the water is even more expensive. Preserving it out of the water would be cheaper in the long run but massivly expensive in terms of capital cost of the facility that would need to be built to dry dock the ship.
Transporting it the Falklands, well you can guess the answer to that one - massivly expensive as the ship would need lots of work to make it safe to complete the trip then you have the ongoing maintenance costs once it gets there which would be far higher than in the UK due to the weather conditions down there. Plus the cruise ships only visit the islands for a few months of the year so revenue earning would be limited.
I used to visit it in Birkenhead quite often when I lived up that way and to be honest the ship was never a major visitor attraction, there would normally only be a few cars in the car park so I can't ever see it being a big revenue generator.
These days things have to earn their keep and I can't honestly see HMS Plymouth being able to do that. The Goverment just don't have the spare cash to contribute to things like this which is a huge shame.
Posts: 9,739
By: Creaking Door - 25th April 2012 at 11:49 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
With respect, that probably had more to do with the location than anything; if you put the ‘London Eye’ in Birkenhead I doubt it would get many visitors...
...and HMS Plymouth survived there for many years.
The government has the money but HMS Plymouth, for some reason, doesn’t tick any of the right boxes.
Imagine it’s thirty years after the end of the Second World War and all the remaining aircraft from that conflict are lined up on the dockside at Birkenhead...
...do you imagine anybody (politicians aside) would scrap them all because of the expense of the museums than now house them?